Wrong tool-offset calculation with Emcoturn 120 ( Rear Tool-Turret)

[Spartan117]

Hey guys,

i just upgraded to 5.10 from 4.86. And it seems like i found a bug, but i can't say if it's only since 5.10


I am using "Horizontal Lathe, Rear Tool Approach" with a greycode-Tool-Turret for my Emcoturn 120.
After installing 5.10 i did a new setup via wizard as suggested in the installation-manual.
I entered 3.05mm Z Style Size in the wizard, as my probe has an "elephant-foot"-tip with dia 10mm and 3.05mm width.

Then i measured all my tools in the turret. To not make any errors with my touch-probe, i have been using the microscope of Emco. This is mounted to a fixed position and has got a crosshair, where you set your tool-offsets with.

So i switched to T0101, jogged that to X0 Z0 of the crosshair (outer contours touching crosshair from approaching direction) and there i set X- and Z-Ref.
Then i switched to T0202 and jogged that to X0 Z0 of the crosshair. There, i clicked on "Measure Offset Z" followed by F10 for manual setting.
The same i did for "Measure Offset X"
I repeated this procedure for all my tools, and then i rechecked everything by switching to every single tool again and entering a G0 X0 Z0 command.

BUT:
All OD-tools have been moved to X0 Z0 of the crosshair correctly.
All ID-Tools have been positioned with a 3.05mm Z-distance in front of the X0 Z0-crosshair!

So every ID-Tool has a tool-offset of 3.05mm too much in Z., for example 23.000 instead of 20.000

To clarify if these are the 3.05mm from Z Stylus Size in the wizard, i changed that value in the wizard to 1mm.

Then, i measured the ID-Tools again like before (ID-Tools are tools #4, #5 and #7 here) and after doing that, a G0 X0 Z0-move positioned all ID-Tools only 1mm away from the X0 Z0-cropsshair.
I rechecked that with 0mm for Z Stylus Size, too, and with 0mm Stylus Size the ID-Tools are measured correctly and become positioned perfectly to X0 Z0 in the crosshair, just like the OD-tools.

That looks like an error with measuring ID-Tools.

So i changed Tool 7 to OD (i had to adapt the nose vector-number, too) and then it gets measured and positioned correctly.

Either the ID/OD-setting or the nose-vector seems to cause this?


Then i re-changed the Z-Stylus-Size to 3.05mm and just edited the wrong measured Z-values of the ID-tools by hand (just calculated -3.05 for every ID-Tool-Z-Value) and now the ID-tools get positioned correctly.

I attached a report, but just to mention: I already changed the Z-Values of the tool-offsets here. JTM

Best regards,

Marc

[cnckeith]

hello.
thanks for posting the report.zip
the error logs show un workable Communication errors.
fix these first.

(4) 06-01-2024 16:28:50 946 PC resending # 443
(4) 06-01-2024 16:28:51 907 Z axis travel exceeded
(4) 06-01-2024 16:29:06 944 MPU requested resend # 41
(4) 06-01-2024 16:29:06 946 PC resending # 445
(4) 06-01-2024 16:29:33 944 MPU requested resend # 42
(4) 06-01-2024 16:29:33 946 PC resending # 448
(1) 06-01-2024 16:29:36 452 Ethernet Communication Error, See Tech Bulletin 270
(4) 06-01-2024 16:29:52 944 MPU requested resend # 44
(4) 06-01-2024 16:29:52 946 PC resending # 462
(4) 06-01-2024 16:29:55 907 Z axis travel exceeded
(1) 06-01-2024 16:29:56 452 Ethernet Communication Error, See Tech Bulletin 270
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:02 944 MPU requested resend # 45
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:02 946 PC resending # 467
(1) 06-01-2024 16:30:03 452 Ethernet Communication Error, See Tech Bulletin 270
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:09 907 Z axis travel exceeded
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:09 907 Z axis travel exceeded
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:13 944 MPU requested resend # 46
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:13 946 PC resending # 469
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:15 944 MPU requested resend # 47
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:15 946 PC resending # 471
(1) 06-01-2024 16:30:29 204 Exiting CNC...Normal Exit (66)
(1) 06-01-2024 16:30:36 199 CNC Started
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:40 9039 Software Exited, Cycle E-Stop/Reset to Continue
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:40 944 MPU requested resend # 3
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:40 946 PC resending # 164
(1) 06-01-2024 16:30:43 CNC12 Lathe v5.10
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:43 9039 Software Exited, Cycle E-Stop/Reset to Continue
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:43 944 MPU requested resend # 6
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:43 946 PC resending # 301
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:47 9033 Reset Initiated, Press Reset to Clear
(4) 06-01-2024 16:30:48 4032 Reset Cleared
(4) 06-01-2024 16:31:32 944 MPU requested resend # 7
(4) 06-01-2024 16:31:32 946 PC resending # 303
(4) 06-01-2024 16:31:36 944 MPU requested resend # 8
(4) 06-01-2024 16:31:36 946 PC resending # 305
(4) 06-01-2024 16:31:56 944 MPU requested resend # 9
(4) 06-01-2024 16:31:56 946 PC resending # 312
(4) 06-01-2024 16:32:25 944 MPU requested resend # 10
(4) 06-01-2024 16:32:25 946 PC resending # 314
(1) 06-01-2024 16:32:34 452 Ethernet Communication Error, See Tech Bulletin 270
(4) 06-01-2024 16:32:35 944 MPU requested resend # 11
(1) 06-01-2024 16:32:35 452 Ethernet Communication Error, See Tech Bulletin 270
(4) 06-01-2024 16:32:35 946 PC resending # 316
(1) 06-01-2024 16:33:27 Creating report...

[cnckeith]

Run the Centroid PC Tuner on the PC and follow all the details in TB270
https://www.centroidcnc.com/dealersuppo ... ds/270.pdf

[Spartan117]

The com-errors are solved, see my other actual thread. And i doubt these are adding 3.05mm to the calculation

The PC-Tuner ist not functional here, as i already stated in the PC-Tuner-Thread.

[cnckeith]

please post a fresh report.zip and we will use your current setup data on our in house test bed lathe to investigate your report.

[Spartan117]

Ok, so here comes the new report. I also testet the Measuring-procedure again after the ethernet-communications-errors are solved now, just to make sure. But the problem still exists. I made some screenshots again:

My Z-Stylus Size was set to 3.05mm

I moved Tool #7 (ID-Tool with nose-vector 2) to a defined position in Z and measured Offset Z. Resulted in Z= -27.737

Then, in the tool-library, i changed Tool #7 to be an OD-Tool with nose vector 3 (because 2 is not possible for OD-tool) and measured Offset Z again at the same position, tool has not been moved at all. Resulted in Z= -30.788. This is 3.05(1) more than the same tool at the same position, but as an OD-tool now.

After that, i changed the value for Z Stylus Size in the wizard from 3.05mm to 0mm, restarted CNC12 and then made the same measures at the same Z-position again.

Changed Tool #7 back to be an ID Tool with nose-vector 2, measured Z Offset again. Resulted in Z= -30.788

Finally i changed Tool #7 to OD-Tool with nose-vector 3 again and also measured Offset Z again. Resulted in Z= -30.788

As i said, the tool has been at the same Z-Position for every single measuring, i just changed ID/OD and Z Stylus Size (and the nose vector of necessity)
Maybe i am doing something wrong, i am just a noob and i still don't have much experience with Centroid, but to me it seems that the 3.05mm of the stylus-size should not interfere here at all? Regardless of ID/OD or nose-vector?

Hope this helps

Best regards,

Marc

[cnckeith]

thanks, good info. we will be working on this on tuesday.

[cnckeith]

also can you post some photos of your machine and setup?

would be good to post them in a photo album so they are all in one spot. google photos is good for this.

[Spartan117]

also can you post some photos of your machine and setup?

would be good to post them in a photo album so they are all in one spot. google photos is good for this.

Sure, i already posted about that in another thread^^ I promised to do soon
Have been wondering myself, why i didn't do that when building that machine in 2022
I had some questions before the build, and while talking about that, i completely forgot to post the build itself after finishing it...

Just as a quick teaser:

[cnckeith]

No worries on the English.
A picture is worth a thousand words!